Diagonally Cut Beam : IMC Worcester

A repost from the tail end of the WTC fires thread: DIAGONAL BEAM CUT See, The problem is, of course, all evidence is debatable and can be supported from both sides. Government supporting story would be that the supporting column (one of the 47 that the 9/11 Commission Report claims doesn't exist) was cut by iron workers clearing debri. Could be supported by: -testimony from steel worker who cut it (none known) -testimony from eyewitnesses who saw him cut it or gave the order to cut (none known) -looks similar to molten slag from a blow torch cut -Photographer testifying that it was done after iron workers got started cutting steel (not known) Our story claims it was cut by thermate charges to relieve the strength of the supporting columns. Could be supported by: -Shows classic dripping slag from thermate melting -the perfectly angled cut is a classic characteristic of a demolition application to relieve the central support columns -there are piles of rubble everywhere, the metal smiths would not likely be hacking at an undamaged beam to rescue people -any metal smith can tell you that slag does not drip like shown since most slag is blown away and only a ribbon of slag remains above and below the cut typically with maybe a short drip or 2.. -any metal smith can also tell you that any cut would have been traced completely around the outside of the column, torch cutting does not leave slag on the outside of a cut, only on the backside. YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE SLAG dripping on the outside. This proves it was not torch cut and that it was Thermate, with no air pressure behind it which is why there is slag "running" down the inside and outside. -any metal cutter would also question why the rear cut is not a straight line, or why the cuts are not straight or horizontal all the way around. The thermate theory can explain that more concentration in that one spot in the back for some reason would melt more steel away, like the edge of a candle melting more than the rest. -additional supporting evidence includes molten steel found in the rubble for 12 weeks after 9/11. To date, only thermate explains this, the government provides no explanation for this, which makes this valid supporting evidence for us. Just present this analysis to any metal smith/torch cutter, which I am, and he can confirm it. Your only supporting evidence would be an eyewitness report from the cutter or other to confirm. None exists that I know of. Or, you could ask the government to answer the question. Think you'll get an answer? Why don't you write the White House and demand that they release all evidence to shut us up if they really have it? Think they will? They won't for us who are demanding answers, and they won't for you. So now what? You going to sit there and claim that a government "for the people, of the people, and by the people" doesn't have to answer to anyone? Even if you don't believe 9/11, there are many other things they are lying about. If they aren't, then why do the refuse to answer questions? No American should have to accept that the government hides what ever they want. If that's how you feel, then you should recognize that that's part of the problem, American's are so brainwashed that we shouldn't question what they say, that you don't even need valid supporting evidence to believe it. They say they have it without providing it, and that's enough for you? You probably still think they are telling the truth about WMD's, and a connection of Saddam and Al Queda when its been proven even by manistream media that they lied. Tax dollars. Are you that much of a sheeple that it doesn't bother you to know that trillions of dollars are missing from both the Pentagon budget and the federal budget? Like 7 Trillion dollars combined. You can accept that they don't have to account for that money when you and I are supposed to account for every penny or go to jail? Knowing that Haliburton is bilking the government for billions, and they are just one of many, and politicains are letting it happen, that doesn't bother you. Do you realize that Haliburton has overcharged our government by close to the entire US education budget of $40 Billion dollars? Yeah, that's really thinking of your kids future if you can ignore that fact. You sheeple just continue to keep your eyes closed, because its the ones with their eyes wide open that is trying to save your sorry ignorant asses. Respectfully, Larry Larry

MR.

This picture has fueled allot of debate and is being used as evidence to support the theory that 911 was an inside job.
Those that believe the towers were blown down are saying
“thermite” was used to cut this beam weakening the structure.

In my opinion this beam was cut by a cutting torch. If you look closely on the surface of the left side of the exposed edge of the beam you can see two lines at the lower left. This appears to be gouges in the steel which is common when using a cutting torch, free handed, in thick steel. The person doing the cutting wavered just so slightly causing the cut to be a little deeper in this area.

If you will notice in the upper right hand corner what appears to be dark gray drippings. This is what is called slag. When cutting thick steel with a torch the melted steel will run down on the opposite side from which the cutting is taking place. Notice the lack of slag on the left face of the beam. This is because it was cut from the outside inwardly; just as the top side and right side bled to the inside. The only question remaining for me is: Why is there slag on the bottom edge closest to the camera? The only explanation I have is that the beam was bent to that side and once the three other sides were cut the beam either fell on over in that direction and the workman cut it from the exposed inner side of the beam. It may have been pulled in that direction and then cut. I see no evidence of this beam being blown with Thermite. Thermite would have left slag on both sides of the cuts. The lack of slag tells me this was directionally cut and the marks in the steal reveals to me the use of a cutting torch.

By no means does this conclude there is or is not a conspiracy involved with the World Trade Center disaster. This only concludes for me, this one beam, WAS NOT CUT WITH THERMITE…..

Inner Core still standing

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1615521411849861778

since your the YouTube god Larry maybe you should post ALL videos.....

It amazes me why you would leave one out showing the inner core not falling first...hmmmm

Even if you don't believe 9/11

Larry states:
Even if you don't believe 9/11.

Wow. That's all there is to say.

the truth is...
No one has to believe it or not. It happened, and there is evidence all around that supports that it happened. Get over it.

About that picture...

Larry the Liar states:
"all evidence is debatable and can be supported from both sides."

THIS IS TRUE. BUT LARRY NEVER GIVES THE CHANCE TO LOOK AT THE LATTER.

YOU DO NOT HAVE ANY F,N CLUE AS TO WHEN THAT BEAM WAS 'CUT.' EVER TAKE THE TIME TO THINK THAT IT MAY HAVE BEEN JAGGED, AND THEN CUT TO MAKE IT SAFER FOR WORKERS IN GROUND ZERO? PROBABLY NOT, CONSIDERING THAT SHOWS TWO FIREMAN STANDING RIGHT IN FRONT OF IT, AND NO ONE WAS ALLOWED INTO GROUND ZERO UNTIL DAY THREE; LET ALONE PHOTOGRAPHERS ON DAY FIVE. THAT LEAVES TWO DAYS FOR YOUR APPARENT 'CUT' BEAM TO HAVE BEEN 'CUT.'

AN INTERESTING POINT

William states:
WAS NOT CUT WITH THERMITE…

THIS IS AN INTERESTING POINT, WHICH ALSO HAPPENS TO BE THE TRUTH.

ANOTHER THREAD FOR TRUTH

http://worcester.indymedia.org/news/2007/01/11870.php

help bring the truth to all Americans.

Here's your proof

DIAGONAL COLUMN CUT If you are an experienced torch cutter, light or heavy metal doesn’t matter, the principles are much the same. There are several facts that indicate it was not a torch cut: 1. No cut from a torch accumulates that much hanging slag. Most slag is blown away; this volume would indicate melting with abundant, directed heat but with little or no air pressure eliminating blow torch possibility. 2. Slag cools too quickly. To drip that long, with the beam itself vertical, that much slag would separate and fall to the ground, and would never drip that far even with that bad a cut. The suggested explanation of Thermate with no air pressure at a much higher temperature would account for this. 3. No experienced torch cutter would take a diagonal cut on 4” thick steel tube. And why would even an inexperienced one do so? There would be no possible reason to do it where a horizontal cut is possible, even if above the cut was bent in the direction towards the lower horizontal cut. And the upper horizontal cut can be seen to be cut also on a downward angle thru the steel. No one would angle from horizontal on 4” thick steel and increase the cut to 5 or 6” thick. 4. No one would cut on an angle thinking that it will cause a standing structure to fall a certain direction, just ask any lumberjack. 5. Any metal cutter would also question why the rear cut is not a straight line and it dips drastically in one spot, this indicates possibly the remains of a round cut which would allow inserting Thermate charges inside of the tube to conceal them (more on this regarding the second photo). 6. Someone implied to me that the cutter would have his hand inside the tube cutting the last horizontal leg to explain the slag on the lower horizontal cut. Impossible, that would mean that 3 legs were cut, and then the beam bent so he could reach inside? You would see evidence of the bend if it was bent before final cutting, and you would see evidence of bending at the conclusion of the cut as the weight takes control. Highly unlikely, and there would be few experienced heavy gauge metal cutters who would agree with the torch cut theory. The second photo has been posted by 9/11 debunkers that supposedly shows a torch cutter making the same diagonal tube cut. This photo either proves that a torch cutter is performing the operation of cutting the column or, he is tasked with completing the cut that wasn’t successful during the demolition: 1. If he started the cut on the right side, why didn’t he finish it? I would say it’s because he’s been assigned the task finishing a cut that was mysteriously ½ done for some reason, maybe thermate that didn’t complete the cut? If there were hundreds of such planted “melts” thru ought the building, its possible that there was an error factor of some that would not burn correctly, but not enough of a percentage to prevent or slow the buildings collapse, except maybe points right near the ground that were basically protected once debri filled in around them. What else supports this? 2. I’ve marked the photo wondering what these other burns are? Did the cutter start on the left top, then decide to move to the bottom, then decide, “Oh, I guess I’ll start on this one over here instead”? And why did he not remove the aluminum façade on the 2 burn attempts on the left tube? Such as on the right one? 3. Given the acrid yellow smoke, it is clearly not steel that is being cut by the worker. Galvanized steel or aluminum burns yellow, steel burns white as shown in the 3rd photo which is a 24” cut of steel which burns white as it most always does (photo source http://www.opetrol.com/gallery.html). Even the burn stains on the aluminum cuts on the right, color match the acrid smoke being produced by the cut work on the left. So it looks to me like the cutter is simply finishing the cutting away of the aluminum façade which is evidently cut away on the far right of the photo to expose the steel hidden beneath it. 4. Aluminum doesn’t cut with an acetylene torch it simply melts and gets blown away by the air pressure. A plasma cutter is the preferred method of cutting aluminum and gives off blue/white sparks and smoke. This worker is most likely using torches he may have on the platform since his task is to cut the heavy beams beneath the aluminum (a Plasma cutter needs electricity). The jagged, unclean edge of the cut aluminum on the right side supports this. A plasma cutter would not leave this kind of edge or yellow smoke or stain. 5. Façade on the outside only so the steel cut in photo 2 indicates cut angled from inside to outside of the building. If the evidence of a possible hole in photo 1 on the high backside indicates where thermate could be installed on the inside of the tube, then the operation would mean they could do this just about anywhere inside the building and covered up by simply repairing sheetrock walls after insertion. 6. The testimony from this iron worker would solve some of this mystery, but without his testimony to confirm otherwise, the facts show that he is clearly making ready to finish cuts that didn’t succeed on their own. 7. Additional supporting evidence includes molten steel found in the rubble for 12 weeks after 9/11. To date, only thermate explains this, the government provides no explanation for this and a lack of evidence is as important is factual evidence.

Photo 2

Photo 3

Nice Try...

Hmmmm.....answer for all your "WHY" questions...

Conditions were not in some wonderful perfect setting of a "construction" site.... They cut how they needed to cut .......

I can see right now you have never worked in a pressure filled situation in the real world....The "Book"
is thrown out the window....A man does what he needs to do.

Simple Truth.

Like I was Saying....

More....

Throw the Book out the window

A Man does, What he has to do

No Protocol here....

Larrys Photo Explained

THIS IS A HYPO-THETICAL GUESS-TIMATION
ESTI-MATION OF LARRYS PHOTO.....

Conversation As Follows to explain the TOP and BOTTOM ARROW in Larrys photo.

****sounds of cutting torch can be heard*******

BOSS: "Hey Antonio,"

Antonio: "Yea Boss"

Boss: "You've been at it for 3 days Tony, drop down and get some rest, maybe some lunch."

Antonio: "But Boss"...

Boss: "Dont give me no shit, jus' get down here"..

Antonio: "al' rite Bossman,"

Boss: ... "plus boy, you know your ass is supposed to take off the %&$##&** aluminum first. Now your ass is dragging...get it down here before ya get hurt"...

Antonio: " I know, I know...but bossman...

Boss: "yea Tony ? "

Antonio: "Put Johnny up in the lift, he can start Above where Im at now.

Boss: " HEY JOHNNY"

Johnny: "Whats up Hoss?"

Boss: " Get the lift, Get your ass in the lift, ABOVE Tony and get to cutting."

Johnny: " Sure thing Hoss"

****sounds of the lift rising , then torch cutting******

Boss: "HEY JOHNBOYYYYYYY".......

Boss: " I change my mind, Get around back and start cutting......I,ll have Antonio finish this up after break"

Johnny: "Gotcha covered Hoss"

TRUTH STATES:

Interpretation is like hairs on a bear.

Many....

Just be careful of which one you pick..

signed,
Truthworks

The "Spin Doctor" is in

And fantasy stories are the best defense you got?

You're proposed totally unsupported, uneducated assessment of the evidence, just makes you look like a continual bullshitter. Act like you know what you are talking about, maybe then people will listen.

"Spin Doctor" shall be your new name.

Larry

SPIN?

THATS THE POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK YOU DUFASS......

You act and thats ACT like you know your ass from a whole in the ground.

1. YOU DIDNT TAKE THE PICTURE

2. YOU WASNT IN THE AREA THAT DAY

3. YOU DONT KNOW THE MAN IN THE LIFT

4. YOU DONT KNOW WHAT AREA THIS PHOTO WAS TAKEN.

5. YOU DONT KNOW WHO MADE THE MARKS

6. YOU DONT KNOW THE REASON FOR THEM BEING THERE.

7. YOU DONT KNOW WHO WAS WORKING THE GENERAL AREA THAT DAY.

8. YOU DONT KNOW ANY OF THE IRONWORKERS
WORKING THAT SPECIFIC SITE.

9. YOU DONT KNOW SHIT.

YOU TALK TALK TALK ....

YOU GRAB A PHOTO THAT YOU KNOW NOT A F'N THING ABOUT AND START TALKING BULLSHIT.

LIKE I SAID YOU HAVE NEVER AND I MEAN EVER WORKED A SITE LIKE THAT SO YOU THINK YOU KNOW THE TRUTH???? YOU DONT KNOW SHIT DUFASS.

THAT DUMBASS STORY I TOLD IS TO SHOW YOUR DUMBASS HOW ANYTHING CAN BE MADE UP TO FIT ANY DAMN PICTURE YOU WANT TO PRODUCE....

I SEE YOUR UNDEREDUCATED ASS COULDNT COMMENT ON THE PICTURES I PUT UP....

WHY I ASK ?....... WELL ITS LARRY.....HE CANT LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE.....
HE CANT LOOK AT THE TRUTH....

HE IS TOO BUSY ON HIS TREASONIST TRACK TRYING TO PROVE THE USA GOVERMENT KILLED 3000 PLUS OF ITS OWN CITIZENS.

OH BY THE WAY, DID YOU MAKE YOUR WAY TO THE FIREHOUSE YET WITH ALL YOUR "PROOF"?

OH AND LARRY....YOU HAD SAID GOODBYE TO US ONCE.....DONT YOU JUST HATE HOW THE TRUTH HAS CONTROL OF YOUR THOUGHTS AND MAKES YOU DO THINGS AGAINST YOUR WILL.....IM IN YOUR HEAD BOY AND YOU HATE IT.

Unsupported accusations is your only defense

The facts speak for themselves. What iron worker experience do you have to refute what is written? None, so you look for character assasination as you only weapon. This is classic of scared ignoramousus. Refute the facts. If you are not qualified, then fidn someone who is. Otherwise, your contribution to the debate is meaningless. All you submit is accusations of "LIES, LIES, LIES!" Its getting old and revealing of your true nature to convince all that everyone's a liar but you and those who support the government account.

AS I WAS SAYING

AS I WAS SAYING..........YOU DONT KNOW SHIT....

WE DONT HAVE TO PROVE OURSELVES...

WE ARE THE TRUTH....YOU ARE HERE TO DISPROVE IT ....BUT YOU CANT.........PERIOD.....

JUST AS I THOUGHT

Gibberish Ranting

You state:

The facts speak for themselves.

All your gibberish is that..Gibberish....

You search on the web. Find "facts"....then act as if you typed it out......

You dont have facts pertaining to the events of that picture.

1. YOU DIDNT TAKE THE PICTURE

2. YOU WASNT IN THE AREA THAT DAY

3. YOU DONT KNOW THE MAN IN THE LIFT

4. YOU DONT KNOW WHAT AREA THIS PHOTO WAS TAKEN.

5. YOU DONT KNOW WHO MADE THE MARKS

6. YOU DONT KNOW THE REASON FOR THEM BEING THERE.

7. YOU DONT KNOW WHO WAS WORKING THE GENERAL AREA THAT DAY.

8. YOU DONT KNOW ANY OF THE IRONWORKERS
WORKING THAT SPECIFIC SITE.

Now Lawrence anyone can rant about anything....You still bring nothing to the table to disprove 9/11.......

*************** NOTHING******************

BUT KEEP TRYING REALLY HARD TO ACCUSE THIS GOVERMENT OF KILLING ITS OWN.....

IF I WAS THIS GOVERMENT ID FIND OUT WHAT YOUR ANGLE REALLY WAS.........

LARRY THE MULTI-TALENTED LIAR

Larry:
“What iron worker experience do you have to refute what is written?”

ME:
WHAT EXPERIENCE DO YOU HAVE LARRY? ARE YOU AN EXPERT ON IRON WORKING, SKYSCRAPER COLLAPSE, PENTAGON MISSILE DEFENSE, MILITARY STRATEGIST AND A DECORATED WAR PILOT? YOU MAKE AS MUCH SENSE AS A “CRIMINAL PLANT.”

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
ABOVE IS A FENCE FOR ‘FENCE POSTING’ LARRY.

FROM MY PARTNER IN TRUTH, TRUTHWORKS:
LARRY STATES AND I QUOTE:

"Homegrown Terrorist? Who did Saddam kill with the nerve gas?"

What, you mean the chemical weapons that we sold him in the early 80's after Reagan took office exposed in the Iran/Contra Affair? Its all government public record, you need only have the guts to read it for yourself. (been there; read that)

LARRY ALSO STATED AND I QUOTE:

How about no weapons of Mass Destruction......

TRUTH STATES:

Did they find any? Nope.......Were they at one time there? YEP........maybe in Syria now but they still be out there.........
I STATE:
1991: OPERATION DESERT STORM (OR OP: OIL STORM IF YOU’RE A LIBERAL)
2003: OPERATION ENDURING FREEDOM
2005: OPERATION IRAQI FREEDOM (OR OP: OIL STORM, JR IF YOU’RE A LIB)
FROM THE TIME THAT DESERT STORM ENDED TO THE TIME WE INVADED IRAQ IN 2005…LEAVES 14 YEARS, OR FOR THE BENEFIT OF OTHERS, 2003 LEAVES ONLY 12 YEARS TO MOVE THE WMD’s TO SYRIA, LEBANON, IRAN, SAUDI ARABIA…THE LIST OF POSSIBLE COUNTRIES GOES ON.

LARRY, I HAVE TO ASK…AND I HOPE I DON’T ASSASSINATE YOUR CHARACTER IN DOING SO…DID YOU JUST JUMP ON THE BANDWAGON AFTER 9/11? WERE YOU ONE OF THOSE FAKES THAT SAID, “YEAH, GO KILL THEM BASTARDS FOR WHAT THEY DID. KILL THEM ALL, LET GOD SORT THEM OUT.” OR WERE YOU JUST THE WAY YOU ARE NOW? “NO, DON’T GO SEEK RETRIBUTION FOR THEIR ACTIONS, FOR IT WAS THE GOVERNMENT THAT DID IT ALL THAT DAY.”

Once again ladies and gents...Larry

"If you are not qualified, then fidn someone who is."

Once again, Larry makes himself look like an ass.

I DID NOT KNOW THAT YOU WERE AN EXPERT ON IRON WORKING NOW. IT'S REALLY AMAZING HOW YOU CAN KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT SO MANY THINGS. YOU SHOULD HAVE GONE TO M.I.T. IF YOU'RE THAT SMART.

AND SINCE YOU KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT EVERYTHING, TELL ME ABOUT THE MILITARY. TELL ME ABOUT THE COAST GUARD, ARMY...I DON'T CARE ABOUT THE AIR FORCE. BUNCH OF LAY-Z-BOY RECLINER SITTING, TV WATCHING PU$$13$. SINCE YOU SEEM TO HAVE AN EXTENSIVE KNOWLEDGE ON THE SUBJECT...FILL US ALL IN.

WE'RE WAITING...

If you are really military.....

....Then you could not be blind to the obvious military stand down that took place on 9/11. Answer me this,

How is it possible for the Pentagon to take a hit 80 minutes into an attack with Andrews Air Force Base 10 miles down the road, built in 1947 for the sole purpose of protecting DC, yet they never scrambled a single aircraft?

Answer this one, how is it possible that live action excercise of aircraft emergency responses average 100 incidents per year with an average reaction time of 17-19 minutes from incident start time to visual acquisition by a fighter intercept, 67 times in 2001 up to September 11th, yet we are supposed to believe that 4 commercial aircraft flew willy-nilly for 100 minutes untouched? Are we supposed to believe that all SOP at FAA, the Pentagon, NORAD, and in the cockpit was ignored at the same time?

Is the answer incompetence, dereliction of duty, negligence, or stand down? If its any of these, why has no one answered for it? I mean, any of these excuses means someone in charge was responsible for the death of 3000 Americans. You see no reason to investigate and hold someone responsible? I think the victim's families do.

And what don't you understand about 25 years of metalsmith, fabrication, machining experience? Find someone to dispute my experience that has as much.
I'm continually wasting my time here. My posts don't even show in the threads. If you are not part of the deceit being controlled here, you should be, your perfect weapons for them with your constant spin and lies. I certainly hope to see both of you swinging on a rope next to the rest of the war criminals controlling this country. Have a nice life traitors, I'll be spending my time warning people about IMC and its hidden control and propaganda. I go away feeling good that I dispensed nothing but truth, I hope it gets harder for you to look in a mirror everytime the news talks about more soldiers dead. How many are you content with sacrificing in Iran, Syria, Darfur, Somolia? See ya traitors, my time is better spent at forums that are not "controlled" by subversive traitors.

Larry

MY POINT EXACTLY

And what don't you understand about 25 years of metalsmith, fabrication, machining experience? Find someone to dispute my experience that has as much.

AMAZING HOW YOU AUTOMATICALLY HAVE THAT MUCH EXPERIENCE IN THE FIELD. THEN YOU WOULD KNOW THAT THERE ARE HOSTILE ENVIROMENTS TO HAVE TO CUT IN. GROUND ZERO WASN'T EXACTLY YOUR TYPICAL HIGH-RISE JOB.

He thinks himself a Scholar???

For some time now Larry has discussed how he is out to prove the USA goverment killed 3000+ USA citizens on 9/11.

So The Truth posted the Education Levels of those who investigated 9/11.

The Truth then asked Larry for his creditials, he has ducked and dodged.

Well America wait no longer.

Straight off the "Scholars for Truth" website comes Larrys Creditials...

They are listed as follows:

In his own words on his website:

Aviation structural mechanic, entrepreneur, Navy service

for those that care: He was a E-4....Top Private he was....TOP GO 'FER

oh and folks that Aviation structural mechanic word, dont let it scare ya, I have a friend that has been one for 19 years, he calls E-4 with 3 years time, "newbies".

THE TRUTH:

WOW....THE GOVERMENT IS RUNNING NOW....

WITH YOUR EDUCATION THEY DONT STAND A CHANCE

TRUTH: YOUR A WANNA BE HERO ....SHEEPLE TO THOSE 9/11 "TRUTHSTERS"...YOU HOPPED ON A BANDWAGON JUST CAUSE ITS THERE.....

Know your enemy, America

Larry P. (AM)
Aviation structural mechanic, entrepreneur, Navy service
Lawrence P. (AM)
Organizer of the Central Mass 9/11 Truth Alliance group

note: This is the same person out of Massachusettes. He is America's real enemy.

TRUTH

Looks like a silence has fallen over the crowd. By golly I think we shut up the lying propaganda machine Larry the Liar.

Diagonally Cut Beam

MR.